Sentinels of the 9th: Setback, order, and choice

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Trajector
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Sentinels of the 9th: Setback, order, and choice

My wife and I just played a game with all the Sentinels batters, Expatriette, and Setback. It was a ludicrous game: we had THREE crushes, one of which was a homer that Setback caught on the fielding check. The other two were singles, eventually loading the bases and giving Setback full fatigue for the last batter: Haka. You can guess who won! Anyway, we encountered three question-worthy scenarios with all the Sentinels playing each other. First, we realized that Setback is confusing. In particular, the order of his abilities. If he gets R+W, and he threw the Unpredictaball, which ability applies first? Or does the pitcher choose? Second, we noticed that Haka's R+W says "* and ..." rather than "* or ..." like many other batters. Does he get a choice to invoke the MVP power or not, if he gets R+W (to take a ball)? The rule book says that when players get both bonuses, they "may" activate the MVP, but the lack of the word "or" made us think maybe the batter doesn't have a choice. (Similar question applies to Kerry Rumble.) Last, when Expatriette was still on the mound, she faced Omnitron, who automatically got a white bonus off her pitching style. During the Stare-Down, Omnitron got the red bonus. We ruled that this would count as a red bonus and a separate white bonus, not a R+W bonus, because Omnitron didn't earn them both by guessing correctly. Is that correct?


Edited by: Paul on Jul 19 2017 - 2:36pm
Donner
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From the games I've played and demoed, here are my answers:

1.  Setback gets R+W and uses Unpredictaball.  What order?

If the pitcher used Unpredictaball (they don't have to), then the Unpredictaball effect has to occur.  They can optionally use the R+W effect and optionally use the Unpredictaball.  Order shouldn't matter at that point, since all of Unpreditaball will apply if used and all of R+W will apply if used.

2.  Expatriette faces Omnitron

There is no difference between a white gained by an ability and a white gained by guessing correctly.  Therefore Omnitron could trigger only his R+W ability (since he got both).  Likewise, if Omnitron didn't guess white but Expatriette did, she could use her W ability even as Omnitron uses his.


"Deja-fu? You've heard of that?"
- Lu Tze, Sweeper, Thief of Time by Terry Pratchett

Trajector
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Donner wrote:

1.  Setback gets R+W and uses Unpredictaball.  What order?If the pitcher used Unpredictaball (they don't have to), then the Unpredictaball effect has to occur.  They can optionally use the R+W effect and optionally use the Unpredictaball.  Order shouldn't matter at that point, since all of Unpreditaball will apply if used and all of R+W will apply if used.


Really?

Setback throws Unpredictaball successfully. The pitcher's dice come up B4 immediately after the throw.......

Unpredictaball changes it to B5.

Setback chooses to use a re-roll and picks the pitch die. It comes up S. (Currently S5.)

Final result: S5

- OR -

Setback chooses a re-roll and picks the pitch die. It comes up S. (Currently S4.)

Unpredictaball changes this to S3.

Final result: S3

Donner
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Good point.  I don't have a good answer for that.  It could be that the pitcher gets to choose.


"Deja-fu? You've heard of that?"
- Lu Tze, Sweeper, Thief of Time by Terry Pratchett

Trajector
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Yeah. I thought for a bit about which way would be more logical, or even whether Unpredictaball should trigger both times, and I couldn't decide.